Wednesday, September 16, 2009
Politics / Woods Carter's Cry of Racism Is No Lie in Tennessee
Posted by Jeff Woods on Wed, Sep 16, 2009 at 8:24 AM
Comments (48)
Showing 1-48 of 48
I think it's pretty obvious when no one can seem to make a clear, coherant arguement based on policy decisions on what exactly Obama is doing to "take our country away" and "destroy our democracy" that the opposition is largely fueled by the fact that a man who "doesn't look like us" is holding the highest office in the land. All this talk about taking away personal freedoms, states' rights, etc. Where were these people when the Patriot Act passed? Perhaps I have missed some secret legislation passing in the middle of the night somewhere, but I'm pretty sure that Obama hasn't put anything remotely radical into law in the past 9 months.
In fact, as a progressive my beef with Obama is that he hasn't done enough - of anything at all. He campaigned on ending politics as usual in Washington and then gets there and spends much of his time in office so far pandering to people who will never side with him. Forget bi-partisianship and trying to make nice with everyone - do something.
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I wrote a blog entry last night regarding Goforth's missing her diversity training
http://www.tomoveanation.com/2009/09/tn-gop-staffer-who-sent-racist-email.html
"To his credit, Richmond(the California blogger who discovered via the Internet the snippets of Sonia Sotomayor talking about 'Latina women' and appellate judges making 'policy') is not what we in the old days called a 'thumbsucker,' a lazy columnist who rarely stirs from behind his desk, who for material just reacts to the items that cross it. This defines the vast majority of bloggers. Richmond is actually determined to add something new to the debate."
-- Mark Bowden, writing in The Atlantic this month, "The Story Behind the Story," about how, he writes, "with journalists being laid off in droves, ideologues have stepped forward to provide the 'reporting' that feeds the 24-hour news cycle. The collapse of journalism means that the quest for information has been superseded by the quest for ammunition."
The article came to mind when I read Interested Citizen's post.
Citizen, what new do you bring to the debate? I ask because it appears that you merely took the original reporting of the Knoxville newspaper and threw on a throwaway opinion of your own, then prompted us to look at it by posting a link on here.
And to top it off, you do it anonymously.
To recall a phrase from 1980s: Where's the beef?
Agree 100%. No way in the world Joe Wilson opens his gaping pie hole and says a thing if the President is white. And the racist southern GOP legislators are feeling emboldened by the teabagger/birther nutjobs doing the heavy lifting for them, lowering the bar and making what was once unacceptable, normal.
My arch conservative friends say, "We were told that any criticism of Obama would be labeled racist!! And it's true!" to which I say, you are a racist, and the sooner you admit it the more respect I'll have for you.
It is interesting to compare the behavior of retire Presidents Bush 1 & 2 to that of Mr. Carter. Carter is outspoken and such a vitriolic and derogatory voice on issues in which he needs not state an opinion, right or wrong. In fact he is beyond outspoken, he is ungentlemanly, rude and it is unbecoming of his station in life. He is not exemplary of a Southern or any other gentleman, let alone a former President of the United States. Comparing his behavior to the Bushs' who have not made one comment on either the current administration nor any hot topic political issues of gossip journalism. Their above board behavior is exemplary of what is expected of this station in life.
Come on, Joe Wilson was a staffer for Strom Thurmond. He said it was disgraceful that Thurmond's african american daughter went public. He has been an advocate for flying the confederate flag on state buildings.
The jerk felt entitled to yell at an african american president.
Mike, what about former VP Cheney's rants since leaving office? Is he ungentlemanly or does that tag only apply to Dems?
For that matter, what about Wilson himself, whose wife asked -- before she knew it was Joe -- "who is that nut hollerin'?"
Are we really surprised that Dubya hasn't commented on issues of foreign or domestic policy since he left office? He didn't have much to say on the matter when he was IN office!
I'm sorry but I appreciate that former President Carter keeps himself involved on an international level and takes an interest in policy issues and working towards resolution in ways that a sitting President cannot. I can't say I always agree with his statements, but I'm definitely appreciative of his work ethic and dedication to issues of world peace, hunger, poverty, etc. and getting out and doing something about it rather than being off playing golf or clearing brush somewhere.
"Rural white voters rejected Obama's candidacy so resoundingly that the color of his skin was the only logical explanation." This is the kind of ignorant ranting of the liberal left that has people up in arms. Are you really so stupid that you totally miss that Tennesseans didn't vote for Obama because of his pro-abortion stance, pro-gay-agenda, and pro-socialist plans for government??? Get a grip on reality or just shut up.
Ok, rural Tennesseans aren't racist, they're just bigoted against gay people and their own self-interest. Got it.
The point, David, is that Kerry's stance on the issues was of no substantive difference from Obama's, but more Tennesseans voted against Obama. What factors differed between the two candidates?
Now the Murfreesboro paper says that school kids openly used the N-word in reference to Obama when he gave his speech to the kids.
http://www.nochaserblog.com/?p=1646
Is that not racist?
"Ok, rural Tennesseans aren't racist, they're just bigoted against gay people and their own self-interest. Got it."
Get back to me if you ever manage to accomplish something that proves you know what anyone else's self-interest is better than they do themselves.
I won't hold my breath because up to this point, no liberal who has ever lived on earth has ever done so.
To Mike Dioguardi,
Comparing apples to oranges not withstanding (as Carter was criticizing tea-baggers, not a President) it is starting to come out that neither thought much of the right-wing base. Here is a snippet: http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2009/09/what-is-bush-thinking.html
And any of you who are claiming this is all about policy, not race, get a grip. Maybe to you, but just check out some of the signs at teabagger rallies and tell me that's not racist. I'll echo what another commentator already posted, that where were all of these angry people during the Dubya years?
I suppose my visceral disgust for Barak's socialism makes me a racist. And equally incorrect is my resistance to referring to him as an 'African-American'. Well tough shit!
Nothing will ever cause me to admire a socialist mindset, I dont care who the purveyer might be. When one considers the former Soviet Union et al it becomes incontrovertably, demonstrably, a failed governmental policy.
And ole' Barak is an American, by God. Un-hyphenated!
Gil's back?
I thought he ran off mad yesterday after his ludicrous argument that celtic music isn't mostly closely associated with Ireland and Scotland was pretty well shot down by everyone, thus undermining his opposition to universal health care.
"We agree that they're bigots though. Right?"
Wrong - since you are incapable of actually proving any such thing.
To quote a Libertarian friend of mine a few years ago, "I voted for Bush in 2000 because I was worried that Gore would mess with gun rights and by 2004 gun rights were about all the personal freedom we had left"
"Gil's back?
I thought he ran off mad yesterday after his ludicrous argument that celtic music isn't mostly closely associated with Ireland and Scotland was pretty well shot down by everyone, thus undermining his opposition to universal health care."
I never went back to thread after my last reply to you, Anon.
Nor did I need to. My word on that matter was and is final.
"My word on that matter was and is final."
Attaboy Gil. Stick to your guns. Sometimes omniscience just has to be gutted out.
"When one considers the former Soviet Union et al it becomes incontrovertably, demonstrably, a failed governmental policy."
This is why many people don't take people like you seriously. Comparing the Obama administration to the Soviet Union puts you in coo-coo for coco puffs territory. This man has been called a radical Muslim (from Kenya no less), a socialist, a communist (a la Electric Larry and is Soviet comment) and a Nazi. All because some of you get all of your information from ridiculous demagogues like Limbaugh and Beck and don't know how to filter obvious slander from real information.
Chris1974...you may as well talk to a wall. These meatheads will never hear you through the thick layering of hate and racism ringing through their empty numb skulls.
I think people who use the word "racial" in the way Wamp uses it are not too bright, probably not bright enough to parse what Carter said about the Wilson incident. Can we agree that you don't have to be burning crosses on my lawn to have some issues regarding race? Oh, maybe we can't.
In this incident with Congressman Joe Wilson speaking out of turn and Jimmy Carter trying to play the race card by stating it's about racism in America.
As God is my witness folks get this through your heads, the Elitists are working hard to play this as the race card! In effort to get us taring at each other's throats - divide and conquer!
No, this thing with President Barack Obama has nothing to do with race, many of us have grown up with all kinds of races outside our front and back doors - that is America and we have for quite some time been able to see the quality in all races! We have been best friends with people of other races and cultures in our day to day lives!
The thing that causes Americans to dislike and not trust or respect President Obama is his Fascist, Marxist style of politics along with his habitual habit of lieing! From the day Americans are born we were taught to dislike any form of communism or oppression of society! Now we have it practicing it's politics in our own back yard!
Not something that will fly in the "Land of the Free and Home of the Brave!"
Charlie Sheen is offering a Live debate on the "Larry King", show with any Government Rep or Reps in lieu with his 20 questions that he has requested sensible answers for from President Barack Obama!
Charlie has had no takers for the debate challenge so what does that tell us? 911 WAS AN INSIDE JOB!
http://www.infowars.com/twenty-minutes-with-the-president/
"Ok, rural Tennesseans aren't racist, they're just bigoted against gay people and their own self-interest. Got it."
Ashley - I think this is pretty oversimplified and part of the answer as to why the democrats can't seem to gain ground in the rural areas of this country. While I'll agree that a lot of the loud opposition to President Obama right now is racially motivated (whether on a deliberate or more subtle level), but when it comes to to the election I think things were more complicated than that. The Republicans have done a better job of selling themselves as the party "of the people", no matter how their policies contradict that. The problem isn't (always) that people in rural places are ignorant, racist, bigots - it's that their interests are different than those in urban areas and the Democrats haven't figured out a way to address them in a way that resonates and the Republicans have.
One of the reasons Republicans have been so successful at this is because they have played the Democrats as liberal elitist snobs and the Dems haven't found a way to change that image. That won't anytime soon if people keep clinging to the stereotype that rural people are stupid hicks being duped by the Republican party and say they're not smart enough to vote for their own self-interests.
Amen Paul Revere! The elitists don't like the truth. Joe Wilson told the truth and he is being maligned for it. It reminds me of that one time, at space camp, where the elitist's who ran the camp kicked me out for arguing with the other campers, and the counselors, that the lunar landing was faked. They said I got kicked out because I was a 31 year old camper arguing with kids and teen-age counselors, but that wasn't it at all. I had hit a nerve by telling the truth. The elitist's can say that Joe Wilson was wrong for speaking up in that "hallowed hall" the congress and for being rude. Some, like Jimmy Carter, say he's a racist. But that isn't it at all. He's being maligned because he was telling the truth. So all I have to say, is keep telling it like it is, Mr. Joe Wilson. And you can expect a check for $5 made out by me, Conspiracy Buff, for your campaign coffers.
I was responding to the post directly above mine that cited Obama's "pro-abortion stance, pro-gay-agenda, and pro-socialist plans for government" as the reasons why rural voters (presumably like the poster himself) didn't vote for him. I was just simplifying his assessment. If those were his reasons, those are pretty dumb reasons. Straight talk!
I get just as irritated as anyone about Southern stereotypes, trust me. I'm from the rural south. Was born there and raised there. I still live in Tennessee, for Christ's sake. But I still managed to develop a conscience. The same conscience that allows me to see that gay men and women should be free to marry is the same conscience that allows me to see every man, woman, and child in the US should have health care. Even those who are afraid of Communists and currently uninsured deserve it.
If this makes me a snob, so fucking be it.
Oh, Gilbert.
You'll also never, never find someone who knows what's been racist or not as those who've experienced racism and that, clearly, you'll never accept.
There's just as much knee-jerk screaming that no remark or action could possibly be racist around, case by case but every single time, here as there are, indeed, those too fast to jump to that as the only explanation of opposition--or belligerence.
There's not a single Democratic President since at least FDR who's not been called or treated as "illegitimate" in some way by the Right, so it's not just about race.
It's also simply being unhinged.
"many of us have grown up with all kinds of races outside our front and back doors"
This is WAYYY too easy. Anyone else want to take a stab?
Ashley, I don't think it makes you a snob, my apologies for thinking those were your words. I just think the Dems as a party need to figure out how to talk to rural people and social conservatives in a way that doesn't talk down to them or disregard their interests/concerns as stupid or ignorant.
Since you bring up gay marriage - look at where it's legal in this country. Calif? NY? Nope. Iowa. Was that done by the big national GLBT lobbying groups in CA, NY or Wash DC? Nope it was done by small groups of grassroots folks who were brave enough to step forward and say "hey, we're here in your communities every day working and contributing to society and we deserve the same rights as you" and they won.
Look at the TDP strategy for winning TN for Obama...oh wait, there wasn't one. The message was, focus on states you can win and hope it gives you enough votes. There was so little effort to even try and get information out to rural folks about who Obama is, so it's not all that surprising that they are no poorly informed now and see him as a threat. Is it right? No. But the Republicans have mastered talking in short (and untrue) sound bites that put these ideas out there and the Dems don't do enough to fight it until it's too late.
As usual the opponents of any kind of restriction on the illegal immigration, is playing the race card? It's a forgone conclusion that the benefactors of promoting a mass invasion of our shores, such as religious groups, unions, ACLU, radical ethnic caucuses and even our own US Chamber of Commerce, will mouth epithets that doesn't benefit big business, that doesn't advocate a continuous force of illegal cheap labor. Now they are really livid because their objection to E-Verify was thrown out of court. Now all federal contractors and subcontractors must adhere to the law. They have conspired against the American worker and people for too long, and now we are fighting back ourselves against corrupt politicians and other elected officials nationwide,
Rep.Joe Wilson was actually telling the truth at the time, and now Democrats have placed restrictive language in the Health care reform package as a reluctant afterthought by public demand. This was nothing to do about bigotry or racism, but the American workers and family survival. None of the business community who hire them wants their labor, but forces the taxpayer to carry the financial load. The US labor force should not have to be in competition, with people from other countries. Businesses have already offshore American jobs, because it's cheaper? So every illegal foreign national and family member should be exempt from government run health care, jobs and all the billions of taxpayer dollars secretly allocated to pay for their support. Twenty million plus illegal people compromised themselves, when they entered a sovereign nation without permission. Find out the truth at NUMBERSUSA, JUDICIAL WATCH and contact your politician at 202-224-3121 demanding no weakening conditions to E-Verify or any other law authored by Congress.
Even before President Carter said this, I was saying it. There is a racial undercurrent that drives some of the anti President Obama demonstrators. Not all of them, but enough that it is noticable. They feel confortable enough at these rallies to parade around openly making everyone aware of their prejudical opinions. And, I believe political personalities Limbaugh,Savage and Beck, to name just a couple, continue to encourage this behavior. I just wonder where it will end. I have concerns that one of these hateful people will feel it is somehow their duty to make an attempt on the life of President Obama.
I can't believe that anyone has the balls to use Jimmy Carter as an example of good policy anywhere. The man was a total failure. I lived through his miserable 4 years. As far as the racist feelings are for the idiot oboma, well all you have to do is recall the reaction from the minority community toward, well let's say republicans for arguments sake. What you really have here is a bunch of bottom dwellers who want everything given to them. They don't like conservatives because they expect responsibility from people. I ,myself , would love to have a president Keyes. Where is the racial biggotry there.
We have a Constitution and the liberals don't like it because it requires personal responsibility. My suggestion is to read the Constitution and the Declaraion of Independance and the Federalist Papers. And if you need any help in definitions use the Websters dictionary, not the Clintonian version.
Phil....I assume if look hard enough I will find these overly emotional kind of words from you directed at the Bush administration when they were using the Constitution as toilet paper for 8 years, right?
Racism is alive and well and living in Nashville public schools. Now here is the dirty little secret: It's almost always black on white. Don't believe me? Ask your kids.
Well, I am from Tennessee and I still live here, so I guess I am a Southerner and I guess you would call me conservative. By the way, I'm white as well. This is what I have to say...
If Thomas Sowell or Walter Williams had run for President, I would have voted for them 100 times over McCain.
Stop calling all conservatives who don't like Obama racists.
from the head of the Republican party -
http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2009/09/a-vile-racebaiter.html
People usually try to act in their own perceived self-interest. If Tennessee hillbillies want no part of the Bush/Obama New World Order, I'd say that makes them more perceptive than the liberal zombies who are waiting for their next gift of my tax dollars.
You can characterize people as racist, but you're wearing the word out. White people are already saying, "Call me racist if you want, I don't care." They realize it's nothing but playground tactics. I think I'll skip the diversity training, because it's nothing but blacks telling white people what to do, say, and think.
Joe Wilson is being excoriated for loudly proclaiming the truth. We are definitely in Reactionary territory, aren't we?
Anyone who looks at this website regularly knows that I proclaimed this fact last year: Obama is Establishment, and he will give you more of the same. You stupid television-watchers need to, like, read a book or something. And listen to Joe.
The difference between Democrats and Republicans is like the difference between Coke and Pepsi: Kind of the same thing, only one's a little sweeter. Both want total control. Are you going to give it to them?
Here are Joe's great ideas for the week: Vote third party! Throw out all the incumbents! Stop voting ideology, vote for the smartest person! Demand IQ tests for politicos! It's up to us to disrupt politics as usual! And we can do it! Let's have some fun with these fatcats!
Reading all these comments makes it obvious to me that we need a third party. Wing nuts are dominating the discussions and neither side makes much sense. Racism does exist in our society so does elitism. Both are despicable. How about a party that respects others and encourages tolerance of opposing viewpoints.
Probably too much to expect from the narrow minded masses on both sides of the aisle.
And what Mr. Limpbone could have said, but didn't, is that Andrew Sullivan is a libertarian who supports a flat-tax, hardly a liberal. Yes, he supported Obama over McCain, but mostly because he is completely disgusted with the modern Republican party and their base of social-conservative, Limbaugh listening, Know-Nothings.
"How about a party that respects others and encourages tolerance of opposing viewpoints. "
That would be nice but would last for about one election cycle, if that. People divide into ideological camps. That's what they do. The founders did and human beings have been doing that since the dawn of humanity. And you think it's bad now. Congressmen literally had fisticuffs (that's what they called it then)on the floor of congress in the early days or our republic. Alexander Hamilton lost his life in a duel that was politically charged.
Joe Wilson just yelled the truth...What is the difference in the past with the Dems booing Pres. Bush? Take away the racial statements...Obama has been waiting to send his people to the South to play the race card. Jimmy Carter has Alzheimers...His mother raised him better. Miss Lillian would beat him with peanuts for speaking out like on this subject.
Your favorite ex president is Jimmy Carter because he is as outspoken and opinionated as some of you. We do not have a bunch of racist in the South after all, you have just proved that by your overwhelming responses. What we do have are a bunch of guilt ridden, anti conservative, ill mannered responders.
One of the things your aging hero did in his press address was misrepresent tea bag protesters. He stated they wanted to 'bury Oboma with Kennedy.' In fact the statement was to bury the Health Care Bill with Kennedy. I guess at his age the faculties are slipping and we will allow this mistake without calling him a liar. Mr. Carter had a very disturbed sister and brother. His wife was hospitalized from depression and his daughter is not well grounded and he shows that the family comes by this honestly.
Now you can attempt to give yourselves license to pummel the Bushes. However, as you are spewing your offensive hate, reflect on the core issue. If you keep your mouth shut when you are in the enviable and honored position of being a former President of this great country, then you should be exempt from the negative criticisms of others. Carter opens himself up to rebuttal just as does Cheney. I will bet however that Cheney accepts the resulting responses. I will also wager that Carter would be highly offended at some negative responses back to himself. You egalitarian non prejudicial people have now decided that everyone in the South is racially prejudice except of course yourselves. You want to label Wilson because he had the audacity to note that Obama was mistaken and intellectually dishonest in at least that one comment. In reality that and other aspects of his address are in contradiction of the written facts. But you have a point, you do not call the President a liar in this chamber. Unless of course you are a Democrat and you are speaking to a Republican president. Then of course it is OK.
I cant beleive that ex president Carters comments a look at as logical or valid. I think he must be senile. He was the most anti-semitic president I can remember. So, when he call Joe Wilson a racist....I dont put much credibility in that statement. I have looked on line and found that Obama did lie on several issues. So, maybe he deserved being yelled at........You lie!
Instead of being evil with Joe Wilson, how about Obama explaining the lies? wouldnt that be a better approach. The problem with pith in the wind is it is quite leftist. They alway take a biased socialist approach.
I think you right-wingnuts oughtta listen to your fellows like Joe Carmen and John Grio and vote for a 3rd party candidate in droves next time. I think they are really on to something there.
So...Carter's and Reagan's and Bush's and Clinton's and Bush's critics were/are motivated by racism? (I could name more, but you get the point.) Give me a break! This Obama critic is motivated by his stupidity and nothing more.
hey guys remember the TTC collector was caught napping? Surprise surprise, yesterday a second TTC driver, who's bus was 15 minutes late decided to take his regular 7 minuet 'doughnut break', leaving his passengers freezing in the bus. He even threatened the passenger who confronted him! (Digg it to make it viral) -
http://digg.com/world_news/Toronto_TTC_bus_driver_s_regular_donut_break_caught_on_video
