Tuesday, August 11, 2009
Phillips / Sports Let's Get Michael Vick Back on the Field
Posted by Betsy Phillips on Tue, Aug 11, 2009 at 7:57 PM
Every day, I feel lucky to have her.
So, no, I am never, ever going to understand how someone could look into the face of an animal like my dog and think to himself not "I wonder if it is physically possible to die from cuteness" but "I wonder if this dog would win in a fight against that dog." I'm never going to understand how a person could take a dog that wouldn't fight and slam it against the ground until it was dead.
Never.
I don't even want to hear justifications for it. I don't want to turn on my radio or my television and hear Tony Dungy talking about how we all shouldn't judge. Michael Vick fought and killed dogs, exploited their best traits (loyalty and tenacity) and their worst (dog aggression) in order to force them to hurt and kill each other, for fun and profit. Hell yes, I'm going to judge.
Michael Vick is an awful person.
He still should be allowed to play football.
I have two reasons.
One. He plead guilty, accepted his punishment, and served his time. His debt to society is paid. Is he still an enormous evil asshole who dog owners should cross the street to avoid? Yes. Should he be banned from even being in the same room as a dog? Yes.
Should he have a right to make a living at a thing that doesn't involve dogs, but involves a thing he has a great talent for? Yes.
Michael Vick served his sentence. That's all he owes us. He doesn't owe us also not being able to earn as much money as he can for the little time he has left as a football player to earn it.
Two (and maybe this makes me an asshole and un-American). Football is a sport in which we say "Yeah, I wonder what it would be like if these guys and those guys just destroyed each other." Football players break their bodies for our entertainment. They turn their brains to mush for our entertainment. Sometimes, though thank god rarely, they paralyze and kill each other for our entertainment.
It's different in scale from dog fighting, but I'm not really sure it's different in kind. Just that one is seen as barbaric and the other is seen as a fine way to spend an afternoon.
I'm not sure how much room someone who watches football has to condemn Vick.
Comments (26)
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Ok it's not often that people make me eat my own words wholesale, without the luxury of salt and pepper, but I think I'll have too. I've said previously that I would not watch a game with him in it, and that I hope he doesn't get back to the NFL. While I still sorta hope he doesn't make it back on a team, and to get millions of people cheering him on... I can't say that he shouldn't be able too any more.
I've argued too many times that ex-cons are treated unfairly and are punished beyond their debt to society. The fact that this one is famous and did something horrendous doesn't give us the right to make an example out of him beyond what we already have.
**sigh** Gee. thanks. Rub my inconsistency in my face :P
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Especially when you compare his case to Dante Stallworth. He killed an actual human being, served 30 days in jail and is now awaiting reinstatement to the NFL.
that was real mr. P cause this makes me eat my words too. he deserves a chance and now i have an understanding on forgiveness. i have messed up in my life before too and people had forgave me.
Vick has served his time, and we have no further right to keep him in jail. That is not to say that we have no further right to keep him off the NFL field by boycotting a team that might sign him. He has no more right to make a living playing football that do you or I. Because of his talent more people may want to watch him play, but that would be an exercise of their choice, not an exercise of his right.
My neighbor is an extraordinary musician. He has the right to try to market his talent, but he has no right to make the public buy it. See the point?
Secondly, football is in no way analogous to dog fighting. The point of football is to advance the ball downfield and to the goal line. The point is demonstrate skill in the execution of intricate plays that require great athletic ability, timing and skill. The point is to win the game and play again next Sunday. Accidents from time to time happen, and despite sophisticated protective gear serious injury is sustained. Injury is a mishap, not the objective of the activity.
The point of dog fighting is to see two animals tear each other's flesh, inflict maximum pain and, ultimately, kill in a merciless manner, all for human amusement. There is no protective gear to prevent injury in a mock fight—the fight is for real and to the death.
Your reasoning may have a momentary appeal to those who fear straying from the image of effusive tolerance they have created for themselves. Upon the slightest reflection, however, it loses its charm.
He's awful, but it'll do more for animal welfare to have his ass back on the field. HSUS can't pay for the kind of press they'll get having Vick back in the league. Reporters and fans everywhere won't let him or anyone else forget what happened to those dogs. I just think of all those dog biscuits pelting him in Cleveland.
If that piece of human garbage is allowed back on the field, I will have lost all remaining respect for the NFL. If it happens, I hope that protestors follow him everywhere he goes.
He should still be in prison, or better yet he should be dead from electrocution and/or drowning -the same torture he inflicted on those helpless dogs.
DPM, of course you can boycott a team that might sign him. Where in my post did you get the idea that I think that would be wrong?
You're shifting the argument to a financial one--teams might not want to sign Vick because of the financial implications of having him on the roster (true enough and, I would argue, fair enough)--for most of your comment only to switch back to the moral argument--teams shouldn't sign Vick because he's a jerk--in your framing.
Those are two different issues. If it's financially too risky to hire Vick, well, then that's that. (Though I think Patrick's right. Folks will turn out to hate him.)
My argument is that it's stupid for people who enjoy a violent pastime to try to make a moral argument for keeping Vick out of work because of his violent pastime.
And please, let's not sit here and argue that football is not dangerous and violent. They wear helmets and pads for a reason.
Animals who perform for our amusement do not recieve the piles of cash typically recieved by professional football players. Football players understand and consent to damaging thier body, dogs that survive fights may get the bitches but certainly not the Benjamins.
There's some relationship--prize fighting dogs and good football players (who aren't the quarterback or the kicker) are both prized for thier brutality on the field or in the ring.
Betsy, that is one good looking staffy.
"Football players break their bodies for our entertainment. They turn their brains to mush for our entertainment. Sometimes, though thank god rarely, they paralyze and kill each other for our entertainment.It's different in scale from dog fighting, but I'm not really sure it's different in kind. Just that one is seen as barbaric and the other is seen as a fine way to spend an afternoon. I'm not sure how much room someone who watches football has to condemn Vick."
With all respect, madam, you are daft. No one ties football players to "rape stands", electrocutes them to make them more aggressive, and shoots them if they don't perform. If you are saying football players have no more free will than caged and abused dogs, then you are frankly either an idiot or delusional.
Comparing football to dogfighting is a false parallel for one reason: Choice.
Animals are innocents. They have no choice and do not weigh the risks vs rewards of entering a dogfighting ring. Human athletes make that choice and, as adults, take the consequences of that choice.
I don't watch football, so my boycott is meaningless, but I disagree with anyone who would cheer on that scumbag.
I'm glad you jumped into this one, B. You make some excellent points.
Chris Green, are you a strict vegan who marched and voted and withheld taxes against every act of war carried out since you've been old enough to do any of those things? If not, then join the growing list of anti-Vick hypocrites. Because our national system of food production has industrialized the torture and inhumane slaughter of animals who feel no less pain than dogs. Can you say without doubt that you've eaten no flesh or worn no skin of any animal that was cruelly (and unnecessarily) tortured and slaughtered? Please lie to me and say Yes.
That "human piece of garbage" has served his time. Do you insist that all those pieces of garbage responsible for the torture and murder of innocent human beings (most notably in the last eight-plus years) serve theirs, and then not be allowed to make a lucrative living? Please lie to me and say Yes.
I'm not a big football fan myself, but I will watch and cheer for any team who puts Vick on the field-- hell, I'll even buy his new jersey-- just to rub it in the face of all you hypocrites out there.
Thanks, Patrick. She is good looking. But look at all the gray on her face! It breaks my heart that she's becoming an old woman. Though I am glad we are past the days when she could leap into a tree to chase squirrels or do backflips off my dad (though I suppose those things explain why her knees are shot now).
Anyway, I'm not saying "OMG! Football is exactly the same thing as dog fighting. We must not condemn dog fighting."
I'm more than happy to condemn dog fighting and dog fighters and Michael Vick. As I so clearly did in the post.
But I don't think there's a moral argument for keeping a proven violent man out of a violent sport, if he's paid his debt to society.
I think the NFL should expell Vick and put this inane debate to rest. The NFL has a code of conduct and Goddell should make examples of the athletes who heinously violate it--Vick and others included. There are dozens of athletes that can take his place. He's not THAT exceptional, nor should he be granted immunity to continue to make millions because he served his sentence.
Plenty of folks pay their debt to society and upon re-entry must find other ways to earn a living--including, for argument's sake, sex offenders who are teachers and tax fraudulent accountants. They're stripped of their licenses and told "figure out something else to earn a living." And you know what? that's the price they pay. It's not a death sentence. It's a little thing called repercussions.
The NFL needs to man up and do the right thing. and THAT is to expell Vick.
B,
That's the first full shot of Ms. W. I've ever seen. Quite a dog! I agree that Vick is horrible but should be allowed to play. It looks as if Donte Stallworth will make an NFL roster before Vick and he killed a HUMAN BEING. Both men made mistakes. Vick actually paid for his. Let the man play and then toss him if he gets in trouble again.
Kade, but no dogs play football, so your analogy doesn't hold up. If he had previously been a vet, sure, he can't ever be a vet again.
He previously used to be a quarterback, which a person can manage to be without ever coming in contact with a dog.
Casey, it's because she doesn't hold still! I have tried to take many full on pictures of her, but they end up like this (though I do like that picture because you get a good sense of her wiggliness).
Out of all these arguments the NFL already has a proven track record for how they handle these types of incidents and players-Ray Lewis.
He's had a successful NFL career and even gets commercial endorsements.
Michael Vick will try to play football somewhere because other than his notoriety, that's the only skill he has or used to have. Whether or not he is still competitive remains to be seen and is a greater consideration to a team than anything else.
"Kade, but no dogs play football, so your analogy doesn't hold up. If he had previously been a vet, sure, he can't ever be a vet again."
It's not an analogy. It's the basic concept that one is subject to actions and their consequences; a precept that athletes are constantly held above time and time agin. Why? Simple: Money.
You'll note by my suggestion of expelling Vick, I'm suggesting that the governing body that pays Vick decides whether or not he should continue to play. Not society, not a poll of angry (which I am also) citizens, not the players, not some imaginary jury that's decided he's paid his debt to society.
If I work at an office and I steal things from that office, I've got to face the music if that office decides to fire me or rehabilitate me. So does Vick. If the NFL refuses to reinstate him (which frankly, is doubtful) then, that's the consequence of his actions regardless of whatever "debt" he has repayed.
The governing body that decides has already issued a tentative ruling that will (conditionally) allow Vick to play.
What I want to know is, do dogs seeking payment prefer cash, checks, Visa, or American Express?
I keep reading "he served his time" and "he paid his debt to society". To the first I say "so what?" and to the second I say "who says?". Why do half of you get to decide Vick has been sufficiently punished, and the other half are hypocrites who need to be ignored?
The law says Vick has been sufficiently punished, otherwise he'd still be behind bars. Don't like that? Work to change the law for the next one caught doing what he did. That's if you really care about the wrongfulness of what he did.
In the meantime you could do something constructive, like focusing your moral indignation on the torturing and murdering of human beings-- done in your name-- that has yet to be punished. And turn yourself into either a strict vegan or into someone who refuses to buy any animal product that was produced using cruel or inhumane practices. Short of that, you are just a hypocrite to be ignored.
W,
Did you not have a Civics class in high school? He was judged by a jur of his peers and sentenced to a prison term which he served. Therefore, the man has paid hsi debt to society. That simple.
I kind of liked the Eagles, anyway, even before the gasbag, pill-popping, racist sex tourist slagged on Donovan McNabb. I hope they win the Super Bowl with Vick on the active roster. Where do I get my jersey?
The law says Vick has been sufficiently punished, otherwise he'd still be behind bars. Don't like that? Work to change the law for the next one caught doing what he did.
So, you're mister law-makes-right now?
Ha! your inconsistency is stunning.
There are so many perfect people that has done no wrong commenting on Vick, how short their memories are. I'm old enough to remember all the things he did to the dogs, hanging, shooting, drowning and more was done all over the south, only difference is the animal of choice was black people, man, woman, and child. and no one was ever sent to prison for even a day. look up the Henry Till story, where a 14 yr old was beaten, shot, hanged and burned, none of the three responsible served a day. Vick did two years and lost millions. what a great justice system, Think brfore you judge.
There are so many perfect people that has done no wrong commenting on Vick, how short their memories are. I'm old enough to remember all the things he did to the dogs, hanging, shooting, drowning and more was done all over the south, only difference is the animal of choice was black people, man, woman, and child. and no one was ever sent to prison for even a day. look up the Henry Till story, where a 14 yr old was beaten, shot, hanged and burned, none of the three responsible served a day. Vick did two years and lost millions. what a great justice system, Think before you judge.
