Thursday, June 25, 2009
Politics / Woods Cammack: 'I'm Not Going to Quit' Belle Meade Country Club
Posted by Jeff Woods on Thu, Jun 25, 2009 at 10:29 AM
"I belong and I'm not going to quit," Cammack told Pith.
Quitting is "sort of the thing to do and I've never fully appreciated it because you know we all have different constituencies of people we may hang out with or are a part of, and I don't see any reason for me to turn my back on anybody, including the employees there," an apparent reference to the black waiters who serve the secretive club's members.
A painting of Robert E. Lee hangs over the fireplace in the foyer of the club, which historically excluded blacks but does now have at least one black member, an attorney who lives in Atlanta and only makes the four-hour trek once or twice a year.
"Nobody has said anything to me about it. No donors, no supporters, nobody. It's the first I've heard of it," Cammack said. Of his fund-raising, he said, "It's hard. It's hard work" but he wouldn't say how much his campaign has received. He added: "I will say your sources are interesting and frenetic."
Update: Pith's smug anonymous insiders are under attack on Braisted's blog. We are polling them now to see if they're shilling for Mike McWherter on the sly. Update II: Aunt B viciously attacks Cammack.
Comments (53)
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So Republican candidate Bill First resigned from this "lily white" club when he ran for office but "Democratic" candidate Ward Cammack won't resign.
Geez, that's not exactly a way to prove to Democratic Primary voters that Cammack is a true convert.
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I'd say it's exactly a way to prove that substance matters more than trite gestures.
It's a way to say, "Screw you little people!!!!!! I'll do what I want."
How can anyone run as a Democrat and belong to a club with a painting of Robert E. Lee in the foyer?!?!?!? Does Cammack not understand how offensive that is to African Americans??????
I want to know about women. Are women allowed in this club? If yes, how many women are in leadership positions?
OMG, what about Cammack's condescending reference to the employees????? "I must stay a member here. My dues help keep these fine colored people employed."
I'm done with Cammack. He needs to go.
Substance? Substance, Berger? Actions constitute substance. Words are cheap. Defiantly remaining a member of a club that excludes people concretely tells us that Ward Cammack does not care to represent all Tennesseans as governor. There's your substance.
Were you reading this release or the back of you own eyelids? I'm pretty sure he did NOT say that at all.
I don't see any reason for me to turn my back on anybody, including the employees there," an apparent reference to the black waiters who serve the secretive club's members.
What else does that mean, Berger?
Jeff Woods, please check your site contact email. If you did not receive it, please contact me at the email entered for this comment. Thanks.
Look at what's in quotes, then look at what's not in quotes. This line (an apparent reference to the black waiters who serve the secretive club's members) is a conclusion reached by Jeff Woods.
If he quits the club, it's a signal to the whole organization, members and employees alike, that association with them is worth losing for political expediency.
Substance, Ben? Yes. Worrying about this unimportant fact is like the fussing over who was or wasn't wearing a flag pin in the '08 presidential race. It had nothing to do with real patriotism.
Likewise, membership in this club has nothing to do with a grasp of the issues our state faces and who has the vision and smarts to deal with them. That's what the race is about, and what bashing or supporting Cammack (or anyone else) ought to be based on.
Are you really trying to argue, Berger, that inclusivity is no more important that a pin on your lapel? If you are, then you are as bigoted as Cammack.
Would the Belle Meade Country Club admit the president of the United States to its membership?
Does Cammack think Obama ought to bring him a drink?
If I ever meet someone who is a member of the BMCC I'm gonna kick them in the jimmy. Hard.
Then run away. Fast.
What do I have in common with Ward Cammock's big, hairy campaign?
We don't give a crap about black people . . . or hispanics.
This is pretty tiresome.Cammack lives within walking distance of BMCC. It's summertime; his young children like going there. Big deal. The Club was once segregated; so was every club and private school in town. It isn't now and hasn't been for fifteen years. Sure, I'd rather he quit, just to avoid all this PC nonsense, but it's also about time someone just said "no" to the Belle Meade litmus test. Cammack is against guns in bars, SJR 127, nuclear power, and blowing off mountain tops to mine coal. He's for gay rights, including the right to marry and adopt children, stricter environmental controls, and explains from a lifetime of experience in finance that what the Republicans like to call socialism is about cleaning up the mess that "free marketers" have left. Who else in Tennessee is saying stuff like that? Conventional wisdom says to take more moderate positions and resign from the Club. He's not doing either. Good for him.
Jeff, if these "insiders" are shilling for McWherter, they'd better be able to explain why Daddy Ned is a BMCC member...
Henry, BULLSHIT!
The stupid fucker said he's staying in the Belle Meade Country Club because African Americans need jobs -- as waiters, of course. He is out of touch with Tennessee.
He also called his campaign "big and hairy." I'm beginning to think he is crazy.
Henry, maybe Ward ought to go down to Wal-Mart and pick up one of those blow-up pools for his kids and then he wouldn't have to pay the country club dues.
If Ned McWherter is a member of the Belle Meade Country Club, then he ought to quit. Period. If he refuses, I will say the same about him as I am saying about Cammack.
Berger, buddy, it is obvious that you are a troll for the Cammack campaign. Hold on to some dignity and quit being a racist shill.
Berger,
Is it a wise move for you and the Cammack crew to attack the most-beloved figure in Democratic Party politics in Tennessee for the last two decade, you dickface?
Love and kisses,
The death of your moronic campaign
Ben, you're amazing. Where in this quote-
"...we all have different constituencies of people we may hang out with or are a part of, and I don't see any reason for me to turn my back on anybody, including the employees there"
-does he say anything about African Americans needing jobs? Do you think the BMCC to be so financially unstable that the loss of one membership would have such an impact? He's referring to how insulting such a politically calculated move would be to the members and people who work there.
And "I don't see any reason for me to turn my back on anybody" is an inclusive statement.
DPV,
If I don't think Cammack being a member is a problem, then obviously I don't think it is for Ned either. It's an issue only if shills for Mike are the ones making hay about it, as Jeff Woods says above in the update.
Ben,
The only way this ever became about race is from your's and JaStep's comments. Cammack didn't take it there.
Wow, berger, you are weak. Cammack is dead.
Your racist, elitist candidate said he wouldn't quit the club because the African American employees need jobs . . .
But, hey, berger, your problem ain't with me. It's with the African American voters. Explain it to them, you racist shill.
Good points, Henry. It's probably laudable that the guy doesn't easily abandon his friends. But in the political context, belonging to a racist country club perceived as racist is as close as it comes to a deal-breaker for liberal and/or black voters. The imagery is just too loaded. So while it might not hurt a Republican candidate, my guess is it's a death blow to a liberal candidate.
I don't see any reason for me to turn my back on anybody, including the employees there," an apparent reference to the black waiters who serve the secretive club's members.
Here's your quote, berger, you little racist bitch.
If you don't understand how racist this quote from Cammack is, then FUCK YOU.
Ben, you're trying to raise an argument which already failed. I've already addressed this once.
This part of the sentence-
"an apparent reference to the black waiters who serve the secretive club's members."
was NOT> something Cammack said. The original writer added that as his own conclusion, his own commentary.
As I already pointed out, the loss of one member is not going to affect that club. No doubt they are well-funded. It's much more clear that Cammack was saying he wouldn't diss them by dropping his membership as a political move.
I get that you want to make this about race, but his statements don't support that.
Pete-
I see what you saying. But it's almost a damned-if-does, damned if he doesn't situation.
He stays in- some people take offense to it, hold it against him. Loaded imagery, like you said.
He gets out- it's seen as a political calculated move lacking in sincerity
It's politics, he's gonna catch crap regardless.
"The stupid fucker said he's staying in the Belle Meade Country Club because African Americans need jobs -- as waiters, of course. He is out of touch with Tennessee."
Sadly, I think this is quite in touch with Tennessee. It is out of touch with Democratic primary voters, at least those in urban districts.
"This is pretty tiresome.Cammack lives within walking distance of BMCC. It's summertime; his young children like going there. Big deal."
While I agree that this issue is probably overblown, that's not good enough a reason to risk the political fall-out. He's not that far from the Green Hills YMCA. Not that big a price to pay, if it's just for the kids.
Pete, you are certainly correct that membership in a fancy, nearly all white country club, has traditionally been the kiss of death for liberal candidates. In Nashville, the BMCC is the poster child of elite clubs. It was slow to integrate or admit Jews and still does not have full memberships for women. But on the other hand, we all know, at bottom, that this is a purely symbolic, mostly phony issue, like asking a liberal politician if he sends his child to a public school. BMCC, today, is no different than many other area country clubs, just harder to get into. It's time to stop waving the bloody shirt.Once a Democrat says "I'm not quitting BMCC" and wins, the issue will be quickly forgotten and, I predict, never raised again.
Henry,
Forgotten by whom? Oh, I know, by the people that the Democrats think have no other choice but to hold their noses and vote for them.
But seriously, how is "By god, I will belong to the almost all white country club by my house because it's most convenient and I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings" the argument a leader makes?
Yes, it's a symbolic issue, but it works as a symbolic issue because the Dems in this state want to play benevolent rich white guy and hate being called on it by folks who want more.
Looks to me like JaStep and Ben would rather resort to name calling and profanities rather than having a civilized, intelligent discussion. Undoubtedly a political operative.
I don't know why you guys think it's symbolic. The club has admitted exactly one black person and that's only because he lives in Atlanta and won't trouble anyone by actually showing up very often. Another black guy, David Ewing, who actually lives in Nashville, had been denied membership for five straight years when Matt wrote this story.
http://www.nashvillescene.com/2008-08-07/news/black-out
That's not symbolic. That's concrete. If you don't think someone should belong to a club that discriminates against blacks, then you probably shouldn't vote for someone who belongs to Belle Meade.
Let's see: Richland, Hillwood, Blue Grass, Sequoia, Ravenwood, Old Hickory, Brentwood...Im sure there are many many more.
Ms. B.,it would be helpful if you could provide a list of all the mostly white clubs in Tennessee which Democratic candidates should not join...lest anyone forget to raise the issue.:-)
I hear you, Henry and Berger. These kinds of things get blown way out of proportion. But the fact remains that this is a hugely loaded deal for a lot of voters, particularly on the left, who see the exclusionary rich man as the devil. The notion that these guys have been plotting to screw regular people behind closed doors goes back decades among all stripes of Democratic voters, even the racist ones. And in a Democratic primary, where the black vote is so important, this kind of thing will blow him out of the water. Like it or not, that's the way of America.
Henry, yeah, see that's the thing. I don't have any idea which clubs in Tennessee other than the BMCC still won't let black people in because I'm not out searching for clubs that don't let black people in to join.
If I stumble across another one, I will alert you. But in general, you can pretty much rest assured that I a (Groucho) Marxist when it comes to club joining.
It's just too hot for civil conversation. I, for one, will just go lay down in a mud puddle and read.
Words are getting put in Cammack's mouth left and right. Go back and read the original blog post on what Cammack said. He referred to employees, not black employees. I've never been to the Belle Meade Country Club but I find it hard to believe all of their waiters are black. Done and done.
Here are the facts:
Cammack is a Republican that supposedly "converted" to a Democrat. It turns out that he belongs to a notorious country club that has a checkered history of allowing membership to minorities and women . . .
And Cammack refuses to give up that membership.
Sounds like he is still a Tennessee Republican.
Bill Frist, a Republican, quit this club when he ran for office, but Cammack, who now calls himself a "Democrat" can't.
Do yourself a favor, Ward Cammack, quit the Democratic primary. It's a farce.
The thing that always kills me whenever I go into the BMCC is that portrait of Robert E. Lee. Front and center, right in the entry hall. A good man, no doubt. But it sends a seriously anachronistic vibe through the place. Are they venerating HIM? Is this the guy to hold up that way? It's a COUNTRY CLUB, fer chrissakes. How weird is THAT?
I personally like it when politicians and judges quit the BMCC for political reasons. It says to me that they're actually aware that the place is not a forward-looking institution. I want my leaders to be looking ahead, not backward at the Lost Cause and the implied notion that things used to be pretty great, back then.
And finally: the half-dosage Lady Member situation is just stupid. Ask a woman BMCC golfer about the club's tee time rules. Antediluvean, I tell you. It amazes me that women put up with this sort of crap.
Jeff: You (and Matt before you) make charges of discrimination based on the experience of one applicant. BMCC would not likely admit you either; does that mean they are prejudiced against graduates of Antioch High School? (come to think of it, they probably are, as am I ). On the other hand, I expect that if David Williams, the African American vice chancellor and general counsel at Vanderbilt, wanted to join Belle Meade, he would get in easily.
But here's the underlying issue that you, Ms. B, and most others contimue to miss. It's to continue to focus on BMCC as if it were any different from dozens of other golf, swim, and tennis clubs across the state and across the country. All were once segregated. All now admit black members and have done so for between fifteen and thirty years, or so. But all remain overwhelming white.(The same is also true of most of the elite private high schools in this area.) In the late 70's and 80's, when most clubs were beginning to integrate but Belle Meade remained all white, many of my liberal friends joined (or stayed at) Richland Club simply because Richland had an African American member or two. That's when membership in BMCC first became a political issue. But where do you draw the line today? Does anybody still care how many blacks belong to Hillwood or Richland or even the once all white, lowly swim and tennis club, Sequoia, where I grew up ? Is anyone demanding that all Democratic politicians resign for all predominately white clubs? (Come to think of it, I believe Gary Odom belongs to Hillwood; Douglas Henry belongs to Belle Meade.) Instead of joining the reflexive left on this outdated issue, you and the rest should acknowledge that BMCC is the one club you choose to paint as some kind of ruling class/KKK headquarters because, in truth, it's the only club you know anything about.
Henry Walker, self-appointed defender of racist country clubs and their deep-pocket exclusivist members asks:
"Is anyone demanding that all Democratic politicians resign for all predominately white clubs?"
Yes. I, for one, am demanding that.
Tip for the politically sensitive: The Nashboro golf course has tons of black players. Maybe up to one-third or half. I don't know if it's a nice course or if it has a fancy clubhouse (I don't know anything about golf), but the aspiring politician would never be bagged on for playing there.
I join with TennRod in calling for all Democratic politicians to resign from these clubs.
I think you're missing the point, Henry.
1. A candidate for governor runs with the promise of representing all Tennesseans, regardless of race. How can Cammack claim that he will do that when he defiantly maintains his membership in an exclusive country club?
2. Cammack is a recent convert to the Democratic Party. He has to prove to Democratic Primary voters that he really has left his Republicanism behind him. This doesn't help. In fact, his how-dare-anyone-question-me reaction reminds me a great deal of George W. Bush. The fact that he sees no problem with his membership makes me think he is still a Republican. Politically, does Cammack have any clue what percentage of the Democratic Primary vote will be African American? How about the percentage of women?
3. Cammack's argument that he will stay a member because the staff need jobs was a jaw-dropping display of condescension. This man is a child of wealth that can't even imagine a life other than his own.
The bottom line, Henry, is that this is a tremendous blunder from a "Democratic" candidate for governor. Cammack's campaign was floundering before this. It is now officially over.
And, Ben, there is the very practical, ahrd-nosed, bottom line political evaluation that needs to be made in a serious campaign:
I would be willing to bet that Cammack, by refusing to leave the club, lose any ope whatsoever of garnering African-American support in the primary -- and even if he somehow squeaked out a primary victory in a crowded field (OK, unlikely, since the field is not all that crowded, but suppose), African-Americans could pretty easily be convinced to sit on the sidelines come general election time.
A Democrat needs more than just overwhelming African-American support to win a general election, of course, but no Democrat can even hope to win without it.
But isn't it too late for that now? Even if Cammack resignes from the BMCC today, it will not be because of any principled decision, it will be because he was forced to by Democratic voters.
The damage is done. As has been said somewhere else, more than once: Cammack is toast.
Well said, TennRod. This finishes Cammack's campaign.
Which is a shame, if you ask me. He showed a lot of promise early. I'd like to know what made this campaign completely implode over the last week or two.
Note to Woods: Kotz has found you a golf course. Nashboro is perfect because it is a. conveniently located near Antioch and b.not a private club at all but open to the unwashed public.
Note to Ben: Cammack's stupid comment about the employees was regrettable. And his campaign has always been a long shot.But, if it fails,it won't likely be because of any club membership but because he is a complete political unknown who is taking outspokenly liberal/intelligent positions on substantive issues, moreso than any other candidate thus far.
From the tone of some of your earlier comments, I suspect that you are more interested in undermining Cammack's campaign than in any discussion of this particular issue. Perhaps if you could tell me which Democratic candidates you support, we can ask what swim/tennis/golf clubs they attend and the percentage of African-Americans at each.
Note to TennRod. At least you're consistent....in a sort of French Revolution, kill-them-all, kind of way. Are there any private swim/tennis/golf clubs with sufficiently diverse membersips to suit you? (I doubt it.) I presume you would also rule out any Democratic candidate whose child goes to MBA, Harpeth Hall, FRA, BGA, Brentwood Academy, Ensworth etc.And then there is Saint George's Episcopal Church,sitting there at the entrance to the City of Belle Meade. Tell me, are all of these predominately white clubs, schools and churches racist institutions? Are all who attend or defend them racist people? Or is that you just generally disapprove of rich people, especially those who chose to become Democrats?
Please introduce yourself at the Jackson Day Dinner; I trust you will be dressed sans-culottes.
Henry, Herron is definitely out for me because he co-sponsored guns in bars and lied about his vote on the EFCA resolution. I was leaning toward Cammack at this early stage because he seemed to be progressive . . .
Until this.
Let me be clear, Henry, that I don't care about private citizens. Join whatever club you like. It's a free country. Elected officials, however, are a different matter.
I have no desire to undermine Cammack's campaign. He seems to be doing that himself. I am disappointed because, again, he seemed to be very progressive, someone that I could support. He now appears to be a bumbling child of wealth bent on doing what he pleases regardless of the consequences.
You have to admit, Henry, that this presents a major problem for a "Democratic" candidate, especially given the fact that Bill Frist resigned from the club when he ran for office. And how is he going to explain saying that he won't quit the club because the African American staff need his tips.
He has certainly bumbled; I'll grant you that. But it's a long campaign and he seems determined to stay the course. Is the BMCC issue a problem? Of course. (Should it be? Of course not.) Will it matter in the long run? Probably not.
Henry, I go to the YMCA with my wife. It gives a dues break to economically disadvantaged people. That's where we exercise and swim.
I don't play golf. I saw earlier in this post that there is a diverse and open place to go for that. We also have state run golf courses, I believe, which are open to all.
I went to public schools, which were desegregated some years ago.
I am not religious. I don't go to church and haven't in years. When I did go to church, I went to the Catholic Church. There was a significant minority presence there.
As a Democrat, I think our candidates should support public schools and send their children there. I expect them not to belong to the Belle Meade Country Club or other clubs and organizations that, by rule or by practice, exclude blacks, Jews, women or, for that matter, whites.
As for churches, I don't know exactly how to answer your question. There are so many of them, and they all seem to think and advocate different things, that I certainly can't say if they are "racist institutions" or not. Probably not.
I can tell you that my perception is that the average all-white Southern Baptist congregation has a solid majority of racists in its ranks, and the Episcopalian Church will not be exactly welcoming to a low-income black family next Sunday morning. But I also know that even the worst of the Bible beating fundamentalist churches do not have a racist doctrine. So the failures f individuals do not necessarily reflect on churches they attend.
But to the point, our elected officials should avoid exclusionary institutions.
Henry,
BMCC membership might not be a hindrance to Republican candidates among their Republican constituencies, but Democrats would harp on it. And I guess I find myself wondering, wouldn't you be giving a Republican candidate a hard time if he belonged?
I do agree that substance is more important than symbolic actions, but as a politician you have to consider both if you want to get elected.
