Monday, December 14, 2009
Creamtastic / Moving Pictures Some Kind of Tribute: Metallica Backs Lou Reed
Posted by Adam Gold on Mon, Dec 14, 2009 at 3:08 PM
I have no idea why, but if history is any indicator, the folks over at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame really have it in for Lou Reed and The Velvet Underground. First, the Hall drags their feet and neglects to induct the Velvets until four years after becoming eligible. Then, at their 25th Anniversary Concert last month, they rope Reed into honoring the VU legacy by giving him Metallica as a backing band for performances of "Sweet Jane" and "White Light/ White Heat." I don't know whether to laugh or cry.
Discuss.
Comments (28)
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I knew I didn't wanna watch that special for some reason. Anyone see whatever MTV awards show it was a few years ago that had The Raconteurs backing up Lou on White Light/White Heat? I remember it being pretty cool, especially for MTV.
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Same here. But the Velvets thing doesn't bother me. The Mothers Of Invention had a far more interesting contribution in the same era and they aren't in. VU were /are very overrated.
I mean it's obviously just opinion, and the Mothers & Velvets didn't like each other much, so maybe there's an ancient rivalry here, but I just can't get them. Same as Warhol, it's like.. BFD. Oh and Lars sucks.
I think the Velvets vs Mothers rivalry had something to do with their shared record label, Verve. Verve gave priority to the Mothers for whatever reason and held back the Velvets' debut album for almost a year so the Mothers' debut could come out first. Verve also refused to really promote the Velvets' record because the label claimed that the Mothers needed the help and the Velvets had Warhol and were getting enough publicity through that connection. Oh, and the Velvets hated Hippies.
Velvet Underground > Mothers of Invention
I certainly don't think there's much to debate over which band ultimately influenced the history of music the most.
I kept expecting Lou to turn around to Lars and say, "Hey, ya wanna lay off the cymbals a bit, asshole?"
Touché! Interesting points Doyle, didn't know that stuff. But have you listened to MOI? They hated hippies too, their whole thing was a satire on hippie culture, just listen to the lyrics in We're Only In It For The Money. Sure VU influenced the hell out of contemporary rock, and in some great ways ill admit, I think the Mothers and (here we go) FZ had a mighty contribution as well. Enough so that your statement on influence is as debatable as mine on overratedness.
Look, Velvet doesn't have to be better than the Mothers or vice versa. Two very different bands going for very different things.
While I prefer FZ, I listen to both, and both got the credit they deserve, but a fist fight between the two would've been fun to watch.
AS far as late 60s Verve-Forecast labelmates go, The Hombres were obviously the best of the bunch. Eatin' a rueben sandwich with sauerkraut.
Don't stop now, let it all hang out.
Damn, burrito, beat me to the punch! Doyle, of course, knows his shit, too. I find this to be a fascinating dialog, for a large part, because MOI and VU form two thirds of my Rock Music Holy Trinity.
The most obvious (to me) common denominator between the two bands is manager Steve "Also, in the same time, I get to work with the Velvet Underground, which is as shitty a group, as Frank Zappa's group" Sesnick.
I'm not sure Frank Zappa "hated" hippies, but in Frank's world, everyone was a potential target for criticism. He was a critic and a cynic. As burrito notes, "Their whole thing was a satire on hippie culture." WOIIFTM was also a satire on the establishment, such as parents, ("Mom & Dad," "Bow Tie Daddy," "Let's Make the Water Turn Black," "The Idiot Bastard Son," "Lonely Little Girl") and the police, ("Who Needs the Peace Corps?" "Concentration Moon," "Mom and Dad") - the status quo and societal norms in general.
As elk so succinctly opines, "Two very different bands going for very different things." Very well put. The Velvets were anarchists, while the Mothers were freaks. To analogize: The Velvets are to the Mothers, as the Beatles are to the Residents (in a way).
To sum up my ramblings, who gives a freaking flying flip about the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame's inductees and recipients? I look to their tutelage in musical taste about as much as I look to the Academy Awards to pick out what movies I want to watch.
Basically I agree with y'all (well maybe not Bawston Sean ;) I just prefer the Velvets to the Mothers personally. The Mothers always seemed too high concept to me and too clever. I appreciate their stuff and have checked it out but it doesn't compel me to further listening. Dig me some Zappa guitar though. Hot Rats, anyone?
So who's the 3rd of your RockMusicHolyTrinity Ingle?
From Doyle:
"So who's the 3rd of your RockMusicHolyTrinity Ingle?"
Answer: Kings Of Leon
Doyle:
They Might Be Giants (my personal favorite (Apollo 18 is a masterpiece)).
Hot Rats: side one only, please.
(I personally think) Absolutely Free > Hot Rats.
Once again, different styles; totally useless comparisons...All-around great music! But Metallica, maybe not so much anymore - this video is too painful to watch!
Though I guess when it comes down to it, the Velvet Underground is more "rock and roll" than any of that other stuff. But more importantly: Why can't modern Lou rock out like he did in the 60s?? I've seen him twice and I refuse to PAY to see him again.
Doyle:
They Might Be Giants (my personal favorite (Apollo 18 is a masterpiece)).
Hot Rats: side one only, please.
(I personally think) Absolutely Free > Hot Rats.
Once again, different styles; totally useless comparisons...All-around great music! But Metallica, maybe not so much anymore - this video is too painful to watch!
Though I guess when it comes down to it, the Velvet Underground is more "rock and roll" than any of that other stuff.
But more importantly: Why can't modern Lou rock out like he did in the 60s?? Having Metallica as his backing band is not much worse than the performances he gave during the Ecstasy or Raven tours (the flamboyant male jazz singer he employed on the latter tour to butcher the vocals on some VU classics was particularly horrendous). I've seen him twice and I refuse to PAY to see him again.
but back to the video... what th' ???
I haven't seen that bad a train wreck in awhile... from otherwise talented people especially. Who thought that was a good idea, who thought rehearsals were good enough, and if I could nominate a sort of video caption contest question: what was Lou Reed thinking while it was going down?
most of the whole special is pretty bad. metallica sound worse than normal and watching this is like a cartoon. metallica playing too "hard" all the time, with lars sucking and james giving "yeeah-yeeeyeaaaaaaAAAH"s to everything. lou looks more confused than ever. they played better with ozzy but that was mostly better cos ozzy did great (but what was with the obvious facial plastic surgery... is this new?)... they insulted then kinda butchered all day... with ray davies, again james with his adlibbing "all day and all of the night -- timmeeAH!"
but at least their performances seemed "honest" in their shittiness. other bands/artists were just backed by these disgustingly huge "pro" backup groups (probably the old-timer's backup bands) stevie wonder and sting playing roxanne and stevie fucking up some of his parts -- insert joke about reading the cues here--... simon and garfunkel were autotuned to atomic cent... wonder if it was like that at the show too or it was all post.
i remember thinking some of the concert was okay to pretty good but maybe that was before the drugs wore off.
Unlike the Lou Reed one, The Ray Davies/Metallic collaboration wasn't even funny, it was just embarrassing, bad and irredeemable. Ugh, thanks for reminding me of it. As far as the rest of the special goes, yeah, it was like watching a bunch of aging rock stars lost in the wilderness together. That being said, Springsteen kicked ass! Haha. Dude totally owned everybody and is still unmatched in maintaining his old-man-rock dignity.
Absolutely Free is a good one: Brown Shoes is a brilliant song. My favorite from that era is Lumpy Gravy or maybe Burnt Weeny Sandwhich. But I'm more a Grand Wazoo era type. That and the '88 band.
TMBG certainly owe something to MOI. Also bands like Ween, Mr. Bungle, Naked City, Sleepytime Gorilla Museum, and Weird Al all owe the Mothers a debt. VU probably has a more high-profile list, and their music is certainly less tedious, but what can I say, I like the high concept!
This video certainly does VU legacy no favors. Metallica are a lowest common denominator if we ever saw one.
bad drums/sounds like bad karaoke this heavy/etc. however, kirk hammett absolutely sucks it through the pants with those stupid, completely-out-of-place, robotic scales.
yeah, springsteen was good as ever but why the fuck did he have to play with goddamn U2? jesus.
As a fan of both I'm obviously not one to complain, but it should be noted that Springsteen and U2 have been guesting at each others' shows since 1987. Also, Patti Smith was a nice addition. What the broadcast didn't show was Smith trainwrecking on her vocal parts. The song had to be restarted.
While I love Ween and the Mothers almost equally. Dean Ween himself once told me he and Gene could never really listen to Zappa.
Guitar-wise, Deaner is strictly from the schools of Funkadelic's Eddie Hazel and of course Motorhead. Perhaps the biggest Zappa influence on Ween was the tape-manipulated high-pitched vocals that both bands utilized frequently.
Kudos to this thread for a healthy discussion involving VU and the Mothers.
I think we need a cover band night pitting the two against each other!
FZ w/ Flo and Eddie was also a pretty good lineup, IMHO (Fillmore East - June 1971 and parts of Chunga's Revenge and 200 Motels are all pretty killer). The Grand Wazoo is a great record, too. Were we talking about the Original MOI, or who really cares?
TMBG has name-dropped FZ and the Residents in an interview I once read (not major influences, though).
BTW, Ween and Bungle are also way high up there in my sacred list.
A cover night would be sweet! I'll stand in for Roy Estrada, if need be. :) Let's make it happen!! Post "VU vs MOI" on craigslist or something. Seriously.
I just posted an ad titled "MOI vs. VU??" on the Nashville craigslist under "musicians."
If you want to play in a MOI tribute show (or know someone else that is interested), please reply to the post. Someone else can organize a VU tribute, if they're interested.
Thanks!
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